Custom Twinstick Project (in progress)

Discuss VO-related projects (Twin Sticks, etc.)
Testament/Seven7
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Custom Twinstick Project (in progress)

Post by Testament/Seven7 » 25 Mar 2009, 22:17

So, i've mentioned this before, and now i think i'll actually start a thread for it.

This idea started after visiting this website...

http://mamecheats.fateback.com/tutorial.htm

Which shows you how to make your own trigger-stick for arcade or MAME machines. I thought, hey, why would this not work for VO?

Considering VO uses digital input, I didn't see a reason why it whouldn't, so I tried.

My first attempt was with a saturn joypad that was basically built for hacking. However i've since accidently destroyed the wiring, and until i fix it, that part of the project is scraped. I "was" going to run it through a converter, but seeing as those converters are getting rarer and rarer, I may or may not finish that aspect of the project.

If anyone wants to donate a spare saturn or dreamcast pcb from an already modded twinstick *cough cough* (joking)

The current pcb is actually from a Pelican universal arcade stick ( a small plastic one), compatable with the ps2, xbox (first_, and gamecube. This project was built with MARZ in mind, but easily seemlessly translates to the SEGA Ages release of VO-OMG. With the announcement of 5.66 on xbl arcade, I figured an xbox - 360 converter whould extend the usability of this project.

The actuall wireing isn't done, untill then, i'll show you the physical twinstick itself...

Image

Please Excuse the crud lighting. and size. I really have no idea what i'm doing with image uploading yet. ^^;;;


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I used Carriage bolts instead of something hollow, so i need to route the wires still...The spacing between the joysticks and the middle button where mesured from a OMG machine, perhaps the most precise mesurments i've ever taken.


Image

Here we see a look at the internals, and the begining of the wiring. The 2 joystick bases and buttons where kindly donated by a friend I had at a Tilt arcade. Said arcade is no longer there (an independently run arcade now is there, and the owner is cool too, he has a Vo-OMG machine, but thats another topic)

Image

Another look. I apologize again for the lighting. That wood base you see was originally going to be the top of a custom built box. I decided to go this route instead, but I may go back and re-build with a full box. I doubt it though, since my concern was/is getting a working set of twinsticks.

I'll be working on the wiring for abit tonight, maybe i'll be done tomorow?

Enjoy.
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Re: Custom Twinstick Project (in progress)

Post by RVR - 42 » 26 Mar 2009, 05:41

Ummm..wow! See...I don't really have any idea how to do that stuff. Never attempted and most likely never will, but that's quite a feat in my eyes. Keep it up dude.
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Re: Custom Twinstick Project (in progress)

Post by NGEFreek » 26 Mar 2009, 06:45

If I find the time/money to do something like this, I will. I've modded multiple consoles so soldering and tinkering would be no problem, its just a matter of finding some blueprints and following directions so I don't screw it up :D

Also, nice job. Looks like they are coming along quite nicley for a custom job. needs more Pizza Hut Box though.
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Re: Custom Twinstick Project (in progress)

Post by RVR - 42 » 26 Mar 2009, 07:15

Hahahah! Pizza Hut. That's golden man, golden. lol
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Re: Custom Twinstick Project (in progress)

Post by Testament/Seven7 » 26 Mar 2009, 17:16

UPdate: and wouldn't you know it, i'm done ^^

well...with the build anyway...

I messed something up with the wiring however...thats gonna take a month to troubleshoot...and i'm not looking forward to it...

At ALL u.u

Here's some pics of the finished (yeah right) product...

Image

a look at the finished wiring of the sticks themselves...such organized chaos...ahh who am i trying to kid, that illusion fell apart...

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A look at the box that contains the PCB, as well as the 3 system connecters. Thats a box from a laptop cooling pad, and it's as close to the "pizza box" as your going to get.

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A closer look at the 2 connecters we are conserned with, and my hand...

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Thats an RJ12 jack, aka, 6 conductor phone line. I wonder if that was my mistake.....

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A look at the pcb box inside the twinstick caseing, I quickly had to change the orientation of it however, the sticks kept getting stuck on the box ^^;;;

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the 4 directions and 2 triggers are each given a 6 conductor wire, to plug into a jack. the grounds are daisy-chained into a mono-jack. The start and select buttons have their own ground, and the 2 are on a separate chain, although i can't get them to work now...

Did i fry the pcb somehow? A bit of static electricity slip in?

Image

How it looks with everything inside it...a pity it's not working how i whould like....

I'm sad now...accomplished, but sad..

It's also possable some of the switches are dead...i dunno anymore...
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Re: Custom Twinstick Project (in progress)

Post by RVR - 42 » 26 Mar 2009, 17:20

Hey man...don't be sad. Most def feel accomplished, though. That is awesome dude. I envy you. Wish I had the drive to start and finish something like that. *high fives* Cypher is proud.
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Re: Custom Twinstick Project (in progress)

Post by MentholMoose » 26 Mar 2009, 21:36

It's not gonna win any beauty contests, but who cares as long as it works! Plus whenever your opponent complains about their controller you have a great comback... "well my controller is made out of a plastic storage bin!" That is, unless your opponent is using the pizza box controller. :lol:
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Re: Custom Twinstick Project (in progress)

Post by Testament/Seven7 » 26 Mar 2009, 21:59

MentholMoose wrote:It's not gonna win any beauty contests, but who cares as long as it works!
the problem is it dosen't, and i don't know why....the joysticks and buttons work, but i dunno about the switches or wireing..
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Re: Custom Twinstick Project (in progress)

Post by Knoxximus » 26 Mar 2009, 22:58

That **** is gross, dog. Straight up.

But, function before fashion I always say. And when you win, you can message the loser a pic of your sticks via the Xbox camera and be like, "You lost to these!". :lol:
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Re: Custom Twinstick Project (in progress)

Post by circuscommando » 27 Mar 2009, 17:32

Knoxximus wrote:That **** is gross, dog. Straight up.

But, function before fashion I always say. And when you win, you can message the loser a pic of your sticks via the Xbox camera and be like, "You lost to these!". :lol:
that would be the best thing ever XD.

seriously though, good job on the completion, many people don't even nearly finish there are many who abandon their projects halfway through :roll:

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Re: Custom Twinstick Project (in progress)

Post by Testament/Seven7 » 28 Mar 2009, 01:06

circuscommando wrote:
Knoxximus wrote:That **** is gross, dog. Straight up.

But, function before fashion I always say. And when you win, you can message the loser a pic of your sticks via the Xbox camera and be like, "You lost to these!". :lol:
that would be the best thing ever XD.

seriously though, good job on the completion, many people don't even nearly finish there are many who abandon their projects halfway through :roll:

Indeed, there be many who dream, but do not put the effort forth.

Unfortunitally, the pcb I decided to work with is not cooperating like it should..so I may need to wire up individual pcb's to different connecters. More work, more tedious, but that much more worth it if it actually works...

On that note, whould anyone happen to have a dreamcast twinstick pcb that they whould part with for cheap/resonable? I sevearly doubt it, but since i have to re-wire it anyway, might as well work true "full" functionallity into it, no?
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Re: Custom Twinstick Project (in progress)

Post by VR-Eli » 01 Apr 2009, 17:41

Hehe, reminds me of this.

Once you have them trouble shooted though I'm curious to see how those Pelican sticks work out.
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Re: Custom Twinstick Project (in progress)

Post by Testament/Seven7 » 01 Apr 2009, 19:39

VR-Eli wrote:Hehe, reminds me of this.

Once you have them trouble shooted though I'm curious to see how those Pelican sticks work out.
I"m actually gonna temporarily replace the pelican stick pcb with something else. For the time being anyway.
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Re: Custom Twinstick Project (in progress)

Post by Davo87 » 01 Apr 2009, 20:35

That **** is gross, dog. Straight up.

But, function before fashion I always say. And when you win, you can message the loser a pic of your sticks via the Xbox camera and be like, "You lost to these!". :lol:
LOL, such direct comments. Sure, get it to work first. Then u'll be more motivated to chip in more to make it look more beautiful. Atleast u took the step to do so.
Hehe, reminds me of this.

Once you have them trouble shooted though I'm curious to see how those Pelican sticks work out.
Honestly how do ppl play with these? The base is rather tall for its small area, its bound to wobble a lot. :|

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Re: Custom Twinstick Project (in progress)

Post by MentholMoose » 01 Apr 2009, 21:26

Davo87 wrote:
Hehe, reminds me of this.

Once you have them trouble shooted though I'm curious to see how those Pelican sticks work out.
Honestly how do ppl play with these? The base is rather tall for its small area, its bound to wobble a lot. :|
I think it's a joke, or something done just for fun and not for usability, like the pizza box stick.
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Re: Custom Twinstick Project (in progress)

Post by Testament/Seven7 » 02 Apr 2009, 03:38

UPDATE TIME

Well, I wired a PS2 PCB to my twinsticks, and all *seemed* well...

So I popped in Marz (save your tomatoes please), set it to "twinstick B", and let loose in challenge mode.

Or tried to at any rate.

The Left Dash button didn't respond, nor did the Right weapon, I believe these to be faults in how I wired the triggers in these joysticks, and requires further investigation, possibly replacement.

Secondly, the micro switch for right stick/right movement, is dying. It works when it wants to, which is only during a hard jar for a jump/crouch, and even then it's finicky, very very finicky.

For some other observations, the sticks are not as responsive as I hoped. I wasn't expecting Voot Quality control here, but the controls seemed sluggish. For a closer inspection, I plugged it into my ps2-usb adapter, and found that the signals are being sent like in rapid fire mode, nothing stays steadily on, but blinks. I suspect this means the other switches are dying as well, or close to it.

Well, you get what you pay for, and since I didn't "pay" for those joystick bases/switches, eh, go figure huh?

*sighs* ironic that the bgm "harmless sigh" was playing when i tested this, I was doing a lot of sighing, none of it harmless...
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Re: Custom Twinstick Project (in progress)

Post by MentholMoose » 02 Apr 2009, 22:37

It's not a constant rapid fire, right? I just want to rule out some "turbo" mode being enabled on the controller. Try verifying your soldering by directly connecting wires instead of using potentially faulty switches. Also try to swap around the micro-switches to distinguish between the good and bad ones.

It sounds like you're making progress! Just try to isolate the various faults (a multimeter would work well for this) one by one and you'll get there eventually. Keep at it and good luck!
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Re: Custom Twinstick Project (in progress)

Post by Testament/Seven7 » 02 Apr 2009, 23:06

MentholMoose wrote:It's not a constant rapid fire, right? I just want to rule out some "turbo" mode being enabled on the controller.


This controller has no such option. A valid point otherwise however.
Try verifying your soldering by directly connecting wires instead of using potentially faulty switches.
Done so.
Also try to swap around the micro-switches to distinguish between the good and bad ones.
When pluged into my ps2-usb adapter, I can see what buttons trigger and don't trigger. Using MARZ to verify that I mapped the buttons right, I can tell exactly which switch (or switches) are faulty, or not working...

on the right stick, the trigger and thumb where cross-talking, so I need to investigate the wireing on that stick physically, i'm pretty sure thats my fault.
It sounds like you're making progress! Just try to isolate the various faults (a multimeter would work well for this) one by one and you'll get there eventually. Keep at it and good luck!
I'd love to find some better stick bases/articulators for this job. On that note, I found my origional mesurments for the stick/button placements.

Thanks for the luck btw ^^
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Re: Custom Twinstick Project (in progress)

Post by Testament/Seven7 » 04 Apr 2009, 00:26

SUCCESS ^^

After replacing the falty microswitch (and having 7 more on standby in case any more fail soon), and correcting the wireing on the trigger (the wire broke off the pcb during assembly of it's casing, fixed it), it now functions very nicely.

I didn't realize such a level of precision was posable in MARZ....though I suppose not many build twinsticks for that game now do they?

I'll be trying with the Sega Ages release later on.

I'm not done yet though, the next step is to wire up a 360 pcb, or find a pre-wired one, and install that as well, though on a separate circuit, to be ready for voot on Xbox live Arcade ^^

In terms of functionality however, it's D-O-N-E-!!!

I dunno weather or not to do something nice to the case, or just leave it as is and use Knoxximus idea of uploading a pic of it to the loser? :P I kinda want to but I kinda don't, I tend to be a better sport than that...still...
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Re: Custom Twinstick Project (in progress)

Post by VR-Eli » 04 Apr 2009, 21:53

Congrats! Hope you can get everything working for 360.
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